Gettin Redy to Rebuild

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Postby Lspav8r » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:27 pm

I need to know what size cleco fasteners and how many I should buy to facilitate rebuilding my lazair.

Also what are the exact sizes of fasteners and rivets I will need for this job? I know to use Stainless Steel in some cases but the shank size is in question here both for SS and Aluminum.

Jim
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Postby uscgairdale » Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:18 pm

Jim,

I have 100 of the #30 (copper) clecos from building a Hummel CA-2. That number was sufficient for opening up the d-cells and fixing the nose ribs. You could get away with less, but I would recommend more to keep everything nice and tight. If you aren't going to open up d-cells you won't need very many at all.

Although not technically the same size, #30 is extremely close to 1/8" and I would argue a neglagible difference. Your rivet choice will depend on what you are working on. I used a lot of cherrymax rivets on brackets and avex rivets for the sheet stuff.

Dave
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Postby Lspav8r » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:12 am

Cherrymax, avex? are these canadian or american manufacturers?

When you say #30 is close are you saying that 1/8 inch is the actual size of all of the rivets in diameter? what about the length of the rivet part that stays in the wing after the pin snaps off.

I hate to sound so picky here but I only want to do this once, and I want to make sure of everything since I have never taken on such a task with such deadly concequences should I do something wrong. IE use the wrong length or diameter rivets in this rebuild.

Im just trying to get the sizes of everything right before I go out and buy all of this stuff.
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Postby russell » Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:27 pm

Go to www.aircraftsprice.com. Read up on rivets by seaching on line. They all have what is known as a grip range. This will tell you how long the rivet should be.

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Postby russell » Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:28 pm

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Postby ozzie » Thu Jan 31, 2008 3:49 pm

There is a series 1 manual in pdf uploaded to one of the yahoo sites it has the rivet sizes, types and lengths and were they are used on the opening page.

the number drills are actually clearances size drills for rivets and bolts number 30 is a clearance drill for 1/8 rivets. you remove an old rivet with a 1/8th drill bit and punch and drill a new hole for a 1/8th rivet with the number 30. same goes for 3/16 and i think for 1/4 you move to letter drill "F" i think from memory.
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Postby Lspav8r » Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:41 pm

ozzie @ Jan 31 2008, 03:49 PM wrote: There is a series 1 manual in pdf uploaded to one of the yahoo sites it has the rivet sizes, types and lengths and were they are used on the opening page.

the number drills are actually clearances size drills for rivets and bolts number 30 is a clearance drill for 1/8 rivets. you remove an old rivet with a 1/8th drill bit and punch and drill a new hole for a 1/8th rivet with the number 30. same goes for 3/16 and i think for 1/4 you move to letter drill "F" i think from memory.
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Ozzie,

When you say remove an 1/8 inch rivet, and punch and drill a new hole for a 1/8 inch rivet with the number 30. Are you saying that all of those old holes are just going to be there for good with nothing in them?

I am talking the entire length of the D Cell.

Man this is sounding more and more scary by the minute.

Or am I just reading something wrong here. I thought that the new rivets would go back in to the old holes.

Jim
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Postby uscgairdale » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:33 pm

Jim,

I took out the rivets on the entire length of my d-cells. It was not a difficult job. Yes, you can reuse the same holes. Take your time to drill out the rivet heads and then punch out the remainder. If you just drill out the whole rivet then your hole will be bigger than 1/8".

I was a bit intimidated by the job, but it wasn't that big of a deal.
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Postby Don » Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:34 am

I made a punch using a cheap pair of pliers. Then drilled a 3/32 hole in one jaw cut the drill bit off epoxied the shank back into the hole and welded a 3/8" piece of 1/4" pipe to the other jaw as an anvil then just drill off the rivet heads and punch the shanks through.
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Postby ozzie » Fri Feb 01, 2008 8:47 pm

sorry raced thru it without making myself clear .

drill the head of the rivit off using a sharp 1/8th drill. then punch the rivit body out with a 1/8th punch. you may have to use a chisel to knock the head off if you drill straight and clean, you may have to back up the job with a metal buck bar when punching the rivet out.
the new rivet should fit cleanly with no slop or binding. As most lazairs were built by backyarders they were possibly originally drilled with a 1/8th drill and to get the rivit in they enlarged the hole a bit in the process so before replacing the rivet run a number 30 drill bit thru it. if there is any adverse slop, elongation go up a size.
a number drill is .003 thou larger to give enough clearance for the rivit to go in without forcing it. a letter drill is .003 thou smaller than it's fractional equivilant. more suited to fitting bolts in situations were zero tolerance is needed. when fitting the bolt most times you need to drive it home or ream the hole slightly..

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