engines 28/lb-25hp

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Postby yankeflyer » Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:11 pm

Hey guys,

Great post and encouragement. I got in the plane at 175 lbs. and the engines were at full throttle, that is not the same as full power. So yes there were a lot of variables, in the equation.

But the damages minimal, the rotax engines are sitting on the bench and I am fairly sure this plane will fly. Though this last experience makes me want to knock on wood any time I say that.

But for right now I have to work on the bus.

I started out with plans to build Alex Strojnik`s S2a.

This thread has great pictures of the engine mounts that I would want for the rotax and I suppose that's plan a for now.
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Postby yankeflyer » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:51 pm

keeping interest high in the lazair - is keeping all our projects promising
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Postby yankeflyer » Thu Nov 27, 2008 2:06 pm

looking at the damage-
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Postby yankeflyer » Fri Feb 27, 2009 7:44 pm

I'm going to put the pioneers and the rotax engines for sale and go electric. I will be keeping the engine mounts for the next application.

The rotax engines are just as I bought them off of eBay, untested and never ran in the pioneers have some history with this forum.

I should have the engines ready for shipping, about the first week of March. And they will be on eBay next week.
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Postby Chappy » Sun Mar 01, 2009 1:35 am

I noticed that Paul Dewhurst over in England recently said in one of the BMAA forums that he was hoping to fly his electric powered Lazair before the end of February. He is using very expensive ($1100 each) German built, brushless outrunner style Platttenberg Predator 30 motors mounted with 32" props. He has found that with the directly driven props these motors will only produce on a continuous bases 60% of their rated output (6 KW out of 10-11 KW, or 8 HP out of about 15) without overheating and failure. The motors turn these props at 7000 rpm, and are very loud and inefficient (as you would expect). The motors are very small, only 4" diameter by 3" long and weigh 3 1/2 pounds! At 50 volts, they require 220 amps for the rated output!! He is using pretty much state of the art Kokam brand SLPB Li-Po lithium batteries to supply that power. I don't know which speed controllers he is using, but it's probably the recommended Schulze ESC Future-40 160H, and they run 2/3's the cost of the motors.

I noticed that Plattenberg has since begun offering a new, more powerful Predator 37 that's rated at 15 KW (that's around 20 HP)! A pair of these with re-drives and appropriate props of somewhere around 42-44" would offer outrageous performance - if only you could afford the batteries needed to produce that much power (almost 300 amps at 50 volts wide open throttle).

Anyway, it appears Paul is using the Lazair as a test mule for a future electric aircraft. I found this article that doesn't mention the Lazair, but it's obvious it's the same program. Very cool:

http://www.eurekamagazine.co.uk/article ... flier.aspx
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Postby yankeflyer » Wed Mar 04, 2009 3:42 pm

Interesting reading Chappy,

Recently have been finding permanent magnet motors similar to the ones used in the Segway, on eBay in the $200 -$300 area. My plane, since I'm going to have it torn down anyway, should have the rudder upgrades and put the control stick back on the floor. Seems like a long way off right now but I am getting in lots of good work on the bus.

Here are some pictures of my collection early lazair power and props and two mufflers.

Unless someone makes me an offer I can't refuse, I will probably put them on eBay the end of the week.
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Postby yankeflyer » Wed Mar 04, 2009 3:43 pm

The Pioneers
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Postby lazairiii » Wed Mar 04, 2009 10:07 pm

From the looks of things, it appears that the props took a prop strike in the dirt. If in fact this happened, this is a red flag in terms of crank shaft integrity and longivity now. If the prop stops or is restricted in it's rotational movement with powered torque on it, the crank will want to twist. Personally, I believe these motors will need to be gone through...or should be anyway prior to leaving the surely bond of earth again.

Were these props on the 185's or the Pioneers? From the pic way up the page, it looks like you had the Pioneers on the ship at the time, but you have the props in the same pic as the 185's, so whatever engines suffered the prop strike should be torn down and gone through

Just my opinion,
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Postby Chappy » Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:30 am

yankeflyer @ Mar 4 2009, 04:42 PM wrote: Interesting reading Chappy,

Recently have been finding permanent magnet motors similar to the ones used in the Segway, on eBay in the $200 -$300 area. My plane, since I'm going to have it torn down anyway, should have the rudder upgrades and put the control stick back on the floor. Seems like a long way off right now but I am getting in lots of good work on the bus.

Here are some pictures of my collection early lazair power and props and two mufflers.

Unless someone makes me an offer I can't refuse, I will probably put them on eBay the end of the week.


Miles,

I've never seen or read about the motors used in the Segways; guess I'll have to find out more.

By the way, I also had a BIG BUS project. I fixed up and converted a 1948 PD3751 GMC bus (ex-Greyhound) almost 40 years ago for use in my motor home/camper business that failed during the 70's gas crises. It had an inline six cylinder, supercharged, 2 stroke diesel that moved it down the road amazingly well. It could easily top 100 mph. And got 8 MPG. Unfortunately, the brakes were nowhere up to the task of stopping all 14 tons of it nearly as well. It was estimated that the chassis had as much as 7 million miles on it!!! I don't think I could handle the Arm-strong (non-power) steering now, or move it thru East Coast traffic without carnage!

Your 12,000 foot shop space is AWESOME. Good lord I could get in trouble if I had a work space that large!

You'll be very pleased with your Lazair after doing the rudder pedals conversion. (Mandatory Lazair content of message).

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Postby yankeflyer » Thu Mar 05, 2009 2:19 pm

I totally agree George, the 185 s for sure should be gone through. As I said before though they are exactly as I bought them from eBay --http://lazair.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=1014 -- as for the Pioneers the only prop strike was to my baseball cap and actually it took two hits. Pictures below.

For sure I'd dug dirt out of the bold heads so I could remove the propellers. But as chainsaw engines I doubt they saw little more stress than a pinched chainsaw chain and stalled engine. The props themselves showed no actual leading edge damage other than just dirty. The other three props that came with the 185s don't look like they have ever been installed and one has never been trimmed down from its original casting day.

No problem with brakes on this bus, school buses are built with the dump truck brakes. 75 mi. an hour is the top end for this set up.

I be posting pictures of the Interior and the bay underneath at my web site later this month.

We try to stay out of trouble herein 12,000 square-foot man cave -- but were so easily called away -- is it happy hour yet.
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